Comments on: Sharia in Ireland — Official

By: seconds out

seconds out — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:36:15 +0000

Unstranger,- Well said. Interesting point about Fianna Fail. Imagine Brian Cowen and Dillie O'Wea in Burkas – it would be an improvment.

By: unstranger

unstranger — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 08:21:02 +0000

As far as I'm concerned Sharia is a wholly evil thing.
It is not surprising in the least that Fianna Fáil have rushed to embrace it; they are an evil entity and wholly comfortable in the company and presence of other evils.

By: Mark Dennehy

Mark Dennehy — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 01:35:36 +0000

They, ostensibly at least, claim that the charging of interest (usury) is unethical.

Well, technically, they claim that Riba is unethical — it's the christians and jews who claim that usury is unethical (it was forbidden by the christian church officially from 325 (and from well before then by the torah) up until the term got redefined to mean "excessive" interest). Of course, it wasn't just the Muslims and the Christians (and the Jews before them); usury was also condemned by green and roman philosphers like Plato and Aristotle and even by the Bhudda. And technically, it's illegal under secular law as well (we call it loan sharking, but it's the same thing).

Yeah, there are a lot of things in Islam I wouldn't agree with, but if you're going to pick on the ethics of interest on loans, you're on shaky ground!

By: norma

norma — Mon, 08 Feb 2010 01:04:44 +0000

BoldPilot "This topic has the potential to expose the true Xenophopic veneer of Irish society "
All too true.
If what Islamic Finance are proposing was offered presently by AIB or BOI the queues would be miles long.
It is a perfectly legitimate and forward thinking banking system, In the UK this banking system has been under Financial Services Authority regs since 2007, buyers are afforder all the protection of a conventional mortgage, unlike sub prime.
All Islamic banks use the Libor index for rental payments.
Islamic banks do not invest in firms involved with gambling, alcohol, tobacco ,pornography.
The banking models are.
1. Ijara; Lease to own, Bank provides property you want, leases it to you, at end of lease ownership is transferred to you.
2. Musharaka; Partnership, You pay 10% deposit, Bank pays 90%, pay rent on share you don't own plus buy shares, The more shares you own, the less rent you pay, cost of share is based on purchase price not market value.
3. Murabaha; Bank buys 100% of property, adds on profit, You pay fixed monthly payments on higher price, no interest over fixed term.
This system was proposed in Ireland late last year but was rejected because The Revenue Commisioners who would have to collect stamp duty at end of loan term, usually about 15 years could not predict what stamp duty rates would be in 15 years time.
I note the joy in Seconds delivery of this topic that the duty on alcohol has decreased, because we surely need cheaper and more alcohol in Ireland not a progressive banking system, Not buying into all that American fear and paranoia and propaganda which has afflicted Irish Society for generations then are you ?

By: BoldPilot

BoldPilot — Sun, 07 Feb 2010 23:33:45 +0000

Nice attempt at trolling there, Seconds Out. I'll bite, just for the purposes of discussion.

Your post (taken at face value) would be the delight of the Sarah Palin and George W Bush mentalities of this world. I heard an interview on RTE Radio this morning where the interviewer posed the "ultimate" question, "Does this mean that our savings might become the tool of the Bin Ladin family??"

This topic has the potential to expose the true xenophobic veneer of Irish society.

Let's just set aside for a moment the fact that the Bin Ladin family (a highly influential and respectable family in Saudi Arabia) have long ago disowned their relative Osama.

The underlying principles of the Islamic faith require that followers observe the principle of Zaqat (the 3rd pillar of Islam). This "pillar" requires that every muslim (not "Islamist" as you label them) gives charitably according to his abilities. It specifically precludes usury, so an ethical muslim lender must only lend money at a controlled and equitable rate of interest.

Do you have an problem with this?

What is your problem with the title Sheikh?

Your post appears to be intentionally inflammatory. I am not personally encumbered by any religious beliefs, but, equally, I don't see the necessity to belittle the belief system of others.